If I Was A Traffic Cop I'd.......

Discussions on better road driving, advanced courses and the like

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z3Dave
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Post by z3Dave » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 20:56

jollyassassin wrote:THE MIDDLE LANE OWNERS CLUB :head: :head:
Seriously im on the motorway in the inside lane doing 60 & am approaching a lifetime member of the above club, what do i do (a) stay in my lane & undertake him or (b) move across two lanes to overtake then back across two lanes to where i started? I know what i should do but it isnt what i always do (policeman reading this) Ok it is what i always do. :D :D :D
I always make them aware of me crossing two lanes to over take them and then cut in front (not taking the mick) but to show them cars can use the insude lane

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Titan
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Post by Titan » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:07

There's a bit in the Highway Code about not undertaking except in lanes of slow moving traffic.
So if middle lane is only going "slow" (65ish)
Couldn't one argue that a 70mph undertake (ie only 5mph faster) is allowable.....:?:

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Post by PVR » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:15

I guess it is as long as you don't weave in and out of traffic.

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RobBruce
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Post by RobBruce » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:17

Overtaking
267
Do not overtake unless you are sure it is safe and legal to do so. Overtake only on the right. You should

check your mirrors
take time to judge the speeds correctly
make sure that the lane you will be joining is sufficiently clear ahead and behind
take a quick sideways glance into the blind spot area to verify the position of a vehicle that may have disappeared from your view in the mirror
remember that traffic may be coming up behind you very quickly. Check all your mirrors carefully. Look out for motorcyclists. When it is safe to do so, signal in plenty of time, then move out
ensure you do not cut in on the vehicle you have overtaken
be especially careful at night and in poor visibility when it is harder to judge speed and distance

268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.


But you're not joining another lane......

Sooooooooooo - can you or can't you??? :rtm:
In God We Trust - everyone else gets PNC'd.

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Titan
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Post by Titan » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:29

RobBruce wrote: Sooooooooooo - can you or can't you??? :rtm:
Yes and no :D
If I'm understanding this correctly, an offence is only committed if you pass on the LHS and then move over to the lane on your right.
Simply passing on the LHS is acceptable provided ou stay in that lane (just like what you do on the hard shoulder :wink: )
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Post by PVR » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:39

And what would be the time limit you would have to stay in that left lane to not be weaving? 1 minute, 2 minutes, 5 miles or what ...

Not very exact.

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Post by estocks » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:46

268
Do not overtake on the left
Sounds crystal clear to me.
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Titan
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Post by Titan » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:46

PVR wrote:And what would be the time limit you would have to stay in that left lane to not be weaving? 1 minute, 2 minutes, 5 miles or what ...
In theory you've got to stay there until every vehicle you passed on the left has re-passed you on your right.......
I can imagine it's very easy to lose count :oops:
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pingu
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Post by pingu » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 21:55

RobBruce wrote:Overtaking
267
Do not overtake unless you are sure it is safe and legal to do so. Overtake only on the right. You should

check your mirrors
take time to judge the speeds correctly
make sure that the lane you will be joining is sufficiently clear ahead and behind
take a quick sideways glance into the blind spot area to verify the position of a vehicle that may have disappeared from your view in the mirror
remember that traffic may be coming up behind you very quickly. Check all your mirrors carefully. Look out for motorcyclists. When it is safe to do so, signal in plenty of time, then move out
ensure you do not cut in on the vehicle you have overtaken
be especially careful at night and in poor visibility when it is harder to judge speed and distance

268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.


But you're not joining another lane......

Sooooooooooo - can you or can't you??? :rtm:
I think it's quite clear that what I do every day is wrong.

267 - Overtake only on the right

268 - Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. I do the former not the latter.

I see the following every day...

A truck is doing 55mph in lane 1 with no traffic behind it for a mile. Lanes 2 & 3 are full of cars doing 60mph. I will use that mile to catch up to within 50 - 100 metres of the truck by doing 65mph in lane 1. I'll then overtake the truck by MSMM into lane 2 and return to lane 1 and do it all again.
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RobBruce
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Post by RobBruce » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 22:05

Overtaking
267
Do not overtake unless you are sure it is safe and legal to do so. Overtake only on the right. You should

check your mirrors
take time to judge the speeds correctly
make sure that the lane you will be joining is sufficiently clear ahead and behind
take a quick sideways glance into the blind spot area to verify the position of a vehicle that may have disappeared from your view in the mirror
remember that traffic may be coming up behind you very quickly. Check all your mirrors carefully. Look out for motorcyclists. When it is safe to do so, signal in plenty of time, then move out ensure you do not cut in on the vehicle you have overtaken
be especially careful at night and in poor visibility when it is harder to judge speed and distance
268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.


Sooooo - by definition, an "overtake" appears to include changing lanes? If you don't change lanes, does that constitute an "overtake" or not??

Discuss......... :)
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Post by gookah » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 22:15

if someone can undertake, then there was room for the other car to be in that lane, therefore they should be charged with driving without due care and ATTENTION as they clearly are not aware of the space on the inside..
and for the ones who think they have a bloody right to remain in the lane regardless of the empty space, booking them will also be satisfying, so can I do it please?

The undertaker should be let off due to his actions being brought on by unreasonable provocation.

I do have a sure fire cure for the middle lane hog...... allow undertaking as in America.... see them all move over then!!!! cos they will try to stop people doing that as well, They all hate being passed...
Lethal injection sounds good too, that could work!!
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Post by Guest » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 22:34

Having driven a few times in America I found no problems under/over taking.

It might make some of the middle lane hoggers pay attention a bit more, they just sit there in their mindless ignorance of anything outside their bubble.

Sorry ... it is my pet hate....

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Robert T
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Post by Robert T » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 22:38

Weaving between lanes on a motorway is pointless and likely to cause an accident if you take moving back to the innermost lane after an overtake to extremes. If you are going to be overtaking another vehicle within a short distance then stay out. If there is faster traffic behind you, shorten the distance you stay out to let it pass, if it is clear, stay out longer rather than changing lanes all the time to pass a line of traffic. If it is wet, leave longer before pulling back in so as not to blind the vehicle you have just overtaken with your spray.

The bit that I always struggle with is at what point can you "undertake" when pulling off onto a slip road with an off lane. I will usually get myself into the correct lane well before a junction and often find that I come up behind vehicles which are doing 55/60 in lane 2 as they are staying on the motorway, and legally I cannot pass them on the inside. So I try stay behind them until the carriageway divides and they are a lane clear of me. Sometimes this gets ridiculous though, as they move over miles (literally) before the carriageway divides, but the only way you can pass is to overtake on the right. Any ideas? Is it just a case of chill and enjoy the music on the stereo?

Cheers R.
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Titan
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Post by Titan » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 22:39

RobBruce wrote: Sooooo - by definition, an "overtake" appears to include changing lanes?
Yes - compare to the single carriageway situation
RobBruce wrote: If you don't change lanes, does that constitute an "overtake" or not??
No !
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Post by gookah » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 23:03

Robert T wrote:Weaving between lanes on a motorway is pointless and likely to cause an accident if you take moving back to the innermost lane after an overtake to extremes. If you are going to be overtaking another vehicle within a short distance then stay out. If there is faster traffic behind you, shorten the distance you stay out to let it pass, if it is clear, stay out longer rather than changing lanes all the time to pass a line of traffic. If it is wet, leave longer before pulling back in so as not to blind the vehicle you have just overtaken with your spray.
I dont think anyone is complaining about someone remaining in a middle or outer lane if there is another vehicle in front within a reasonable distance that they want to pass.
The problem is with people who remain in the middle or outer lane, sometimes even on an empty motorway, if I am approaching faster and someone is overtaking me, I have nowhere to go, they could move over but don't.
You should always return to the inner lane after overtaking manoeuvres are complete as per the highway code.

I dont really care if they sit in the middle lane all day, as long as they move over when someone needs to get past. they can go back after if they want. :colourful: or just let me undertake legally
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unclemart
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Re: If I Was A Traffic Cop I'd.......

Post by unclemart » Fri 21 Aug, 2009 07:41

RobBruce wrote:With my new change in vocation I have had loads of people telling me what they would do in this position.....

Anyone else got pet hates???


Rob
Light the blue touch paper and stand well back ...........
Gooood thread its almost therapy :D

Lane Hoggers need a slap simples........ :wink:

Hate to say it but the french have it right - only two lanes and their discipline is much better than ours in the Uk - They indicate - overtake and get back in - or they leave the indicators on and stay out over taking all the way......(usually all in an old 205 at light speed :drive )
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MarkOliver
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Post by MarkOliver » Fri 21 Aug, 2009 10:14

Be a little bit more tolerant about a little bit of speed on the M6 toll......it used to be the case that you pay your £4.50 and you could put your foot down a bit and miss all the usual jams...But on a recent return journey I saw many people being stopped by unmarked cars (a dark blue five series appeared to be the preferred vehicle of chose).

It would be interesting to know what the usage to accident ratio is on the M6 toll compared to other more rural motorways that have similar levels of traffic. I say this because I guess the average speed on the M6 toll is probably a little bit different.

I guess the challenging thing from the Polices stand point is making the cost and logistics work between the regular M6 and the Toll. Once you are on the Toll (doing tickets) it must hard to get to a serious incident on the M6....penny has just dropped that is why all the cars are unmarked? Note to self trust nobody behind you on Toll.

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pingu
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Post by pingu » Fri 21 Aug, 2009 15:22

Abit out of date, but it's probably still true...

http://www.speedcameras.org/speed-camer ... .php?id=75
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Post by **Z3** » Sat 06 Mar, 2010 15:59

For what its worth, I think everyone who has a basic licence on the road is not safe/suitable for driving!

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Post by Jonttt » Sat 06 Mar, 2010 20:13

:?:
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Post by **Z3** » Sat 06 Mar, 2010 20:34

Jonttt wrote::?:
Apologies - I should justify such a statement - the current standard to obtain a legal license is far too low - this, I personally and firmly believe is the sole reason for the poor driving on the roads today! It has nothing to do with bad driving, signage, speed cameras blah blah blah.....

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Post by vzh7gk » Sat 06 Mar, 2010 21:01

Jules75 wrote:People who don't indicate at round abouts! I'm sorry, but I didn't have the mind reading chip installed at birth! :head:
I'd rather they didn't indicate, than indicate incorrectly, as many seem to do!

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Jonttt
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Post by Jonttt » Sat 06 Mar, 2010 23:17

**Z3** wrote:
Jonttt wrote::?:
Apologies - I should justify such a statement - the current standard to obtain a legal license is far too low - this, I personally and firmly believe is the sole reason for the poor driving on the roads today! It has nothing to do with bad driving, signage, speed cameras blah blah blah.....
Now that I agree with and the old saying "you only learn to drive after you've passed your test" :wink:

But I also believe that to drive "properly" 100% of the time requires 100% concentration and 100% of people do not concentrate for 100% of the time :D

I attended a "re-education "course" a couple of years ago as an alternative to 3 points on my licence. I would like to class myself as an experienced driver (ie >30,000 per annum for 25 years) but it really opened my eyes to the bad habits and lack of concentration everybody has for much of the time.
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Daz2626
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Post by Daz2626 » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 00:09

Off on a tangent but........ On the last slip on to the M1 before the M62 slip off......... A batenburg Volvo screamed down the slip onto the M1 missing me by about 3 FOOT :shock: No blues and twos on :shock: and cut the guy up in middle lane aswell :shock: would this be classed as dangerous driving :?:

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Devon Z
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Post by Devon Z » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 11:38

Daz2626 wrote:Off on a tangent but........ On the last slip on to the M1 before the M62 slip off......... A batenburg Volvo screamed down the slip onto the M1 missing me by about 3 FOOT :shock: No blues and twos on :shock: and cut the guy up in middle lane aswell :shock: would this be classed as dangerous driving :?:
No...their professionals :lol:

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Post by **Z3** » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 11:39

Jonttt wrote:
**Z3** wrote:
Jonttt wrote::?:
Apologies - I should justify such a statement - the current standard to obtain a legal license is far too low - this, I personally and firmly believe is the sole reason for the poor driving on the roads today! It has nothing to do with bad driving, signage, speed cameras blah blah blah.....
Now that I agree with and the old saying "you only learn to drive after you've passed your test" :wink:

But I also believe that to drive "properly" 100% of the time requires 100% concentration and 100% of people do not concentrate for 100% of the time :D

I attended a "re-education "course" a couple of years ago as an alternative to 3 points on my licence. I would like to class myself as an experienced driver (ie >30,000 per annum for 25 years) but it really opened my eyes to the bad habits and lack of concentration everybody has for much of the time.
Hmmm, I agree totally with your concentration theory! However, being as passionate as i am about driving, I have to totally disagree with the old saying of *Oh I do over 30,000 miles a year I`m very experienced!". Yes you are experienced, but very experienced at driving with your bad habits!

I dispair every time I hear people saying "oh I`ve never had an accident and been driving before you were born!" this may well be true, but are better drivers accomodating your bad driving techniques? Driving is not about experience it is about education! Lots of people think they know better, but I assure you, being educated will not only make you safer, it will reduce wear and tear on your car, and give you the skills to drive faster (yes YOU can drive faster and safer than you currently do!!). I`m not suggesting you break the speed limit but rest assured you can drive round bends faster and safer than you currently do!

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Hard Top
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Post by Hard Top » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 12:03

Some people drive me round the bend faster than others do.

HT

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Post by **Z3** » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 12:04

Daz2626 wrote:Off on a tangent but........ On the last slip on to the M1 before the M62 slip off......... A batenburg Volvo screamed down the slip onto the M1 missing me by about 3 FOOT :shock: No blues and twos on :shock: and cut the guy up in middle lane aswell :shock: would this be classed as dangerous driving :?:
Apologies in advance I know I`m getting on my high horse, however I want to answer your question before the guilty party is put out to hang.....here goes....

Firstly, police do not require to have blues and twos on whilst using their exceptions from the road traffic Act.

With regards to cutting you up and the other driver, I would like to know if you had to take corrective measures, or was it a case of they just got incredibly close?

If, as you say it was exactly three foot between you and the Police vehicle then i would suggest you were given an awful lot of room! Let me justify this....

In order to use excemptions to the Road Traffic Act i.e exceed speed restrictions etc you must attend a three week intensive driving course - this is just so you can use blues and twos! During this course you are put under immense pressure, day in day out! You are trained to the highest level possible - higher in deed than the Institute of Advanced motorists.

It is difficult to describe in writing how intensive this course is and how well you are trained. Needless to say at the end of it, you have a higher level of understanding on how a car works, moves, and reacts under different circumstances - as such what would appear to a member of public as a close maneourve is in fact totally safe and executed with precision. Police drivers, unlike the majority of drivers are taught to plan their drive well before it has actually occured. Therefore all factors are taken into consideration before a move is even considered let a lone executed.

I know I`m going on somewhat, but I really am passionate about what is PERCIEVED as risky and what actually IS risky!

Please remember - when you see an emergency vehicle responding it is because YOU (a member of public) require urgent assistance - at the same time as driving, updates are being passed to the Police driver by a control room, it requires immense training and concentration to listen, drive and react to so much information as well as predict what other drivers are going to do when hearing/seeing the Police vehicle! you would not believe what some people do!!

OK, so rant over - and apologies again for going on!

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Hard Top
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Post by Hard Top » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 12:14

The Stig listens to classical music amongst other things.

HT

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Hard Top
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Post by Hard Top » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 12:37

By the way, I drive on the right, occasionally going left, but sill on the right.
The 'Boys in Blue' over here were given (a few years ago now) 911's.
After having crashed a few, they were withdrawn, and they now have Opel Astra's plus the odd Volvo.

HT

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pingu
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Post by pingu » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 13:33

Hard Top wrote:Some people drive me round the bend faster than others do.

HT
Laugh of the Day - that's made me really chuckle :lol:
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Post by 6 pot roadster » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 13:39

**Z3** wrote:
Please remember - when you see an emergency vehicle responding it is because YOU (a member of public) require urgent assistance - at the same time as driving, updates are being passed to the Police driver by a control room, it requires immense training and concentration to listen, drive and react to so much information as well as predict what other drivers are going to do when hearing/seeing the Police vehicle! you would not believe what some people do!!
Am I to belive that this implies that they are not concentrating 100% on the road... shame on them... ! somebody should book them for undue care and attention!

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pingu
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Post by pingu » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 13:42

Daz2626 wrote:Off on a tangent but........ On the last slip on to the M1 before the M62 slip off......... A batenburg Volvo screamed down the slip onto the M1 missing me by about 3 FOOT :shock: No blues and twos on :shock: and cut the guy up in middle lane aswell :shock: would this be classed as dangerous driving :?:
I assume that you saw him coming and moved over in your lane to give him maximum clearance.

My definition of dangerous driving is causing someone else to brake / swerve violently. Did either of you have to do that?
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Post by Daz2626 » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 18:09

Braked by natural response and it was 10.30 Friday night,just hope he knew what he was doing. :|

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Post by **Z3** » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 18:36

6 pot roadster wrote:
**Z3** wrote:
Please remember - when you see an emergency vehicle responding it is because YOU (a member of public) require urgent assistance - at the same time as driving, updates are being passed to the Police driver by a control room, it requires immense training and concentration to listen, drive and react to so much information as well as predict what other drivers are going to do when hearing/seeing the Police vehicle! you would not believe what some people do!!
Am I to belive that this implies that they are not concentrating 100% on the road... shame on them... ! somebody should book them for undue care and attention!
As far as I`m aware no one pays 100% attention to the road? If this was the case you would not be observing people on the pavement, road signs and all the other various hazards of driving - as far as I`m also aware your not taught to concentrate 100% on the road...if this is what your doing perhaps YOU should be booked for undue care and attention....???

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Post by 6 pot roadster » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 19:26

Its a fair cop. nice reply,

I was refering to the super human abiltiy of our law officers to use two way radio communications whilst on the move looking for 'mortals' to book for doing just the same.

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Post by **Z3** » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 19:49

6 pot roadster wrote:Its a fair cop. nice reply,

I was refering to the super human abiltiy of our law officers to use two way radio communications whilst on the move looking for 'mortals' to book for doing just the same.
I take my hat off to you, and thanks.

If your as sad as me, which i doubt, and you really want to re-produce what is going on in a Police vehicle do this.....

Switch your car radio on (any channel). Do a rolling commentary as you drive ( say everything you are doing as you are doing it and ((verbally)) point out all the hazards you see and are anticipating ((out loud))). If you can still keep control of the vehicle (safely) and remember where you are going - then perhaps a career with the boys in blue is for you...?

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Post by **Z3** » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 19:55

pingu wrote:
Daz2626 wrote:Off on a tangent but........ On the last slip on to the M1 before the M62 slip off......... A batenburg Volvo screamed down the slip onto the M1 missing me by about 3 FOOT :shock: No blues and twos on :shock: and cut the guy up in middle lane aswell :shock: would this be classed as dangerous driving :?:
I assume that you saw him coming and moved over in your lane to give him maximum clearance.

My definition of dangerous driving is causing someone else to brake / swerve violently. Did either of you have to do that?
Accepted above was your own personal view of dangerous driving - howeve something to think about - just because said driver is caused to swerve, surely this means this driver is not driving safely him/her self?

Now before you start shouting at me! Every driver should be well aware of his/her surroundings, and should have bult in to their driving plan a form of escape plan i.e no matter what occurs you should be able to deal with it by allowing enough space between the driver in front of you and behind? With regular mirror checks etc you should always be aware of the other drivers around you and what they are doing, therefore allowing lots of time for you to react? If this is not the case your driving to fast or dangerously yourself!!

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Jonttt
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  M roadster S54
Location: Liverpool

Post by Jonttt » Sun 07 Mar, 2010 20:08

**Z3** wrote: Hmmm, I agree totally with your concentration theory! However, being as passionate as i am about driving, I have to totally disagree with the old saying of *Oh I do over 30,000 miles a year I`m very experienced!". Yes you are experienced, but very experienced at driving with your bad habits!

I dispair every time I hear people saying "oh I`ve never had an accident and been driving before you were born!" this may well be true, but are better drivers accomodating your bad driving techniques? Driving is not about experience it is about education! Lots of people think they know better, but I assure you, being educated will not only make you safer, it will reduce wear and tear on your car, and give you the skills to drive faster (yes YOU can drive faster and safer than you currently do!!). I`m not suggesting you break the speed limit but rest assured you can drive round bends faster and safer than you currently do!
Z3, I do agree with the above comments, like most things repetition (and therefore "experience") only leads to exaggeration of bad habits unless you were taught properly in the first place. I can't comment on the current test but certainly when I took mine the driving test did not teach you how to drive (ie as per your original post).

However, what experience can teach you is how to anticipate and get a sixth sense about things ie the more miles driven the more likely you are to exerience similar situations again and again.

Like everything mistakes ARE made whilst driving, but just like everything else in life the art of learning is all about realising you have made and mistake and learning from it. The best driving course in the world can only "prepare" you properly on what and how to learn. At the end of the day you need to be out there with miles under to your belt to really learn how to drive.

I'm sure police drivers fresh out of training, really learn to drive with experience just like everybody else.

Also anyone who does 30,000 miles a year "thinks" he can drive. In my actual experience (from many "company" race events) they are the worst drivers on either high performance road driving or track as they bring all of their bad habits to a place were the margins for error are that much smaller, exaggerating any error. There are many different types of driving and no amount of miles prepares you for fast road / track driving. I have seen "company" car drivers be physically sick after a lap at silverstone with a GT driver (and that was in a four seater company car).

Anyway I'm waffling a bit but for the avoidance of doubt I'm under no illusion of being a good driver (I have driven with good drivers way beyond my ability and as a good friend of mine often reminds me, he has forgotten more than I will ever know). I could be so much better, but I know that and after 25 years driving I still enjoy learning and practicing :wink:
Happiness is not around the corner........happiness is the corner
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**Z3**
Joined: Sat 02 Jan, 2010 13:03
Posts: 226

  Z3 roadster 2.2i
Location: Torquay

Post by **Z3** » Thu 11 Mar, 2010 12:14

Jonttt wrote:
**Z3** wrote: Hmmm, I agree totally with your concentration theory! However, being as passionate as i am about driving, I have to totally disagree with the old saying of *Oh I do over 30,000 miles a year I`m very experienced!". Yes you are experienced, but very experienced at driving with your bad habits!

I dispair every time I hear people saying "oh I`ve never had an accident and been driving before you were born!" this may well be true, but are better drivers accomodating your bad driving techniques? Driving is not about experience it is about education! Lots of people think they know better, but I assure you, being educated will not only make you safer, it will reduce wear and tear on your car, and give you the skills to drive faster (yes YOU can drive faster and safer than you currently do!!). I`m not suggesting you break the speed limit but rest assured you can drive round bends faster and safer than you currently do!
Z3, I do agree with the above comments, like most things repetition (and therefore "experience") only leads to exaggeration of bad habits unless you were taught properly in the first place. I can't comment on the current test but certainly when I took mine the driving test did not teach you how to drive (ie as per your original post).

However, what experience can teach you is how to anticipate and get a sixth sense about things ie the more miles driven the more likely you are to exerience similar situations again and again.

Like everything mistakes ARE made whilst driving, but just like everything else in life the art of learning is all about realising you have made and mistake and learning from it. The best driving course in the world can only "prepare" you properly on what and how to learn. At the end of the day you need to be out there with miles under to your belt to really learn how to drive.

I'm sure police drivers fresh out of training, really learn to drive with experience just like everybody else.

Also anyone who does 30,000 miles a year "thinks" he can drive. In my actual experience (from many "company" race events) they are the worst drivers on either high performance road driving or track as they bring all of their bad habits to a place were the margins for error are that much smaller, exaggerating any error. There are many different types of driving and no amount of miles prepares you for fast road / track driving. I have seen "company" car drivers be physically sick after a lap at silverstone with a GT driver (and that was in a four seater company car).

Anyway I'm waffling a bit but for the avoidance of doubt I'm under no illusion of being a good driver (I have driven with good drivers way beyond my ability and as a good friend of mine often reminds me, he has forgotten more than I will ever know). I could be so much better, but I know that and after 25 years driving I still enjoy learning and practicing :wink:
Yes - I agree with your thesis - practice leads to mistakes and we learn from these - this in gerneral I think is how we all learn to an extent! I think what I`m trying to say is that whilst, yes, those of us who have driven thousands of miles are more aware of hazards etc the basic driving standards to obtain a licence are "I believe" to low! You only need to look at all the comments on this thread of Road rage, under taking, speeding, middle lane hogging etc etc, if all drivers understood the intricate laws of driving then the roads would be such a nicer place to drive, sadly no one is taught this (other than those that choose to improve themselves) therefore we ultimatly end up blaming each other on the road for not being able to drive in peace!!

jamesac
Joined: Sun 08 Aug, 2010 20:40
Posts: 46

  blank.gif
Location: Worcester

Post by jamesac » Sun 15 Aug, 2010 21:02

clowns who think that on a sunday night on the M5 with NO ONE around, can drive at 55/60 MPH in the middle lane,

i drive in the left hand lane if no one is on the motorway but why do these people do this??????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i have to move over two lanes to overtake and then move back two lanes due to the idoit who more often than not, has their fog light on and full beams on

:head: :head: :head: :head: :head: :head: :head: :head:

GROMMIT
Joined: Wed 10 Nov, 2004 09:43
Posts: 205

  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: EAST MIDS

Re: If I Was A Traffic Cop I'd.......

Post by GROMMIT » Wed 08 Jun, 2011 19:29

RobBruce wrote:With my new change in vocation I have had loads of people telling me what they would do in this position..... and suicide does NOT count! :shock:

I thought I'd throw it open to all and start off a good old rant about peoples pet hates on the road. (Robin - are you there? Ranting required!)

SOME of mine include kiddies in the back with no seatbelts; those who park on zig-zags and especially the to55ers who sit in the outside lane at red traffic lights, then move off 2 feet only to stop then indicate right :evil: Where's me pen? :rtm:

Anyone else got pet hates???


Rob
Peolpe who don't indicate at roundabouts.
Middle lane hoggers.
Most HGV drivers have no road manners.
Pepole who open their car door onto mine.
I also think that anyone who causes an accident on a major motorway should have their licence taken off them for 12 months. If you can't drive at 70 MPH in a straight line you are obviously a spastic and don't deserve to hold a licence.

I'd hapilly gas all of the above.

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sidtheranger
Joined: Sun 18 Jul, 2010 14:45
Posts: 193

  Z3 roadster 1.9
Location: Dorking

Post by sidtheranger » Wed 08 Jun, 2011 19:57

**Z3** wrote:[ Driving is not about experience it is about education!
'fraid not. I know what you're saying about the people who've been driving since the Model T but...........
T
here is no shortcut to experience.
Having worked with Police drivers, I can assure you that as skilled as they are at skid recovery, brake control and awareness, some have fallen short when faced with heavy snow, dense fog and off road skills.
Only actual time on the road (and off it, in a controlled sense, of course) can bring you into contact with weather variables and the variety of ar**holes that drive. This brings experience.

I also believe that motorcyclists go on to be some of the best drivers around. Due simply because of the sixth sense they need to hone to survive the aforementioned ar**holes to stay alive. :lol:
Blessed are the Cheesemakers

boustrophedon
Joined: Thu 01 Oct, 2015 21:29
Posts: 34

  Z3 roadster 2.0

Re: If I Was A Traffic Cop I'd.......

Post by boustrophedon » Tue 06 Oct, 2015 08:36

All the numpties who pull over into the left hand lane on the M1, going south, 2 miles before the exit to the M25, causing a massive tailback in the slow lane and when you actually get to the exit for the M25 the junction is totally clear and you can easily move over from the middle lane to take the exit at leisure.

One day I would like to take something very old and very large, say a Landrover 101 through Radlett on a Saturday morning and take off every car door that is opened in front of me without the driver looking to see if it is clear to do so. Oh sorry was that your Porsche door I just hit...

boustrophedon
Joined: Thu 01 Oct, 2015 21:29
Posts: 34

  Z3 roadster 2.0

Re: If I Was A Traffic Cop I'd.......

Post by boustrophedon » Mon 21 Dec, 2015 17:53

OK so I have to nominate the <insert socially unacceptable adjective here> white van driver who forced me off the road and threatened me with a spanner.

I drive home from work on country lanes through Hertfordshire and Bedfordshire villages. That's why I have a Z3. Late setting off home so the traffic was heavy. Coming out of Whitwell the traffic was crawling in a queue. White van ahead in the queue overtakes the car in front on the inside, by taking an off road excursion and literally forcing his the nose of his van into the gap between the cars ahead. I pulled back to give him a wide berth. The traffic speeds up to 40 mph plus.

A Little later I see him pull off into a side road and stop; then he starts reversing out into my path.

What would you do? That's right; a good long blast of the horn to let him know I am there. Thought nothing more of it.

Two miles down the road and he's up my rear bumper flashing and honking. So I pulled over to let him past, actually I did not realise it was the same van. Guy stops, his passenger starts screaming at me and the driver gets out with an 18 inch long spanner (That's English for wrench) and threatens me with it: "come on you c**t do you want some?" So I pulled off sharpish, but he still managed to kick my rear indicator which is now cracked.

It is a little worrying to think that there are psychopathic nutters out there on the road.

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