Looking to buy a Z3 2.8 for £4,695, a good deal?

UK forum for general and technical discussion about the Z3 roadster

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Buy it?!?

Hell yes!
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No way!
9
33%
 
Total votes: 27

r3v3r3nd
Joined: Sat 28 Feb, 2009 16:07
Posts: 16

  Z3 roadster 2.8

Looking to buy a Z3 2.8 for £4,695, a good deal?

Post by r3v3r3nd » Sat 28 Feb, 2009 17:02

Hey forum, I've just joined and wouldn't mind some opinions.

I'm looking to get rid of my trusty under-powered first car Peugeot 106 and have settled on the Z3 2.8 as a fine replacement. I just drove one today, and I'm really tempted, but I'd like some advice as to whether its a good deal!

Its a S-reg Z3 2.8 with 95k miles on the clock. Silver paint, black roof and red leather interior, its got some extras like heated seats and air con. The current asking price is abit over £4.5k.

The roof is slightly faded but doesn't appear to have any rips and the plastic rear window is ok. All the electrics work and the bodywork looks free from dents.

I took it for a 30 min drive (on my own, awesome) and I loved the power, though because its so planted it felt about 3 times as heavy as the 106. The throttle pedal seemed pretty heavy too, though smooth, is this just the way the car is? Managed to return it with the fuel light on too 8-).

There are two concerns I have, the first is that I'm getting rid of a S-reg car with 108k miles to replace it with another that has 95k miles, though obviously the BMW has a better build quality than the french one. Are there any other high mileage Z3 2.8 owners on here who can put me at my ease, that the next 20 thousand miles will be pretty reliable?

The car seems to have been serviced according to the automatic intervals but that brings me to my second problem, the car is meant to have a full service history, but the documents are missing, so the independent dealer managed to get some figures from his BMW garage. I am going to ring my local BMW Service desk on Monday to try and verify the history, but should warning bells be ringing about its absence??

If anyone can help me clear these issues up, I hope to be a member of the z3 owning community soon!!

PS, pictures attached.
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Fbmwsh

Post by Guest » Sat 28 Feb, 2009 17:16

I've said it before, but all you get for a BMW service is a fancy overpriced oil change.

If the car has had oil changes at the intervals indicted by the idiot lihgts, It's a sign of OK but not wonderful oil change intervals, with the odd spark plug and air filter change thrown in.

If the car runs OK, and looks OK, it is prbably OK.

Expect about 200,000 miles form the engine, if not double that. VW say that their engines will run for 400,000 miles, given decent maintenance, and where I lived in the UK, our local taxi driver ran Passat TDIs for 350,000 miles before changing them, and had no problems at all. BMW are as good as VW.

Stoned@Home
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 19:35
Posts: 283

  Z3 roadster 2.0
Location: Sea of Green

Post by Stoned@Home » Sat 28 Feb, 2009 17:36

your salesman can only check the service history, if he knows where the BMW dealership is that had it for ALL it's services, as the dealerships are not linked for this information, you can check the warrenty claims for the Zed at any BMW dealership.

Mine is 2.0 V reg 2000 build date sept 99 has 33K on the clock,
got it about 6 months ago £6,250, Fully service history..BUT...
it belonged to the wife of some guy called Dimbleby from the telly, they split up Zed was parked up for ages, bit of a lapse in service in time lenght not in mileage.

I'm not going to bother with the BMW service anymore
As long as you use the approved product types e.g same oil type, viscosity etc.. As Mike said it's over priced dribble

or take it to a garage, get them to stamp your book with mileage
as long as it's serviced proper like :lol:

Yeah i know it helps keep the price of your vehicle.. But
my mate didn't have much of a clue about cars, he took his 3 series to Bmw Wellsway in Bath, for a service or even inspection 2.
they said ideally your should get a new camshaft, my m8 duh okay..£1200 later :lol:

Just make sure it don't over heat, 7 previous Beemers i've had all like to overheat...
just wanna make sure the head gasket don't fail.
I have noticed with the Zed that they are better for keeping their cool.

I would keep looking, as much as them red seats is nice... the newer style is better.

pangster
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:09
Posts: 593

  blank

Post by pangster » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 10:26

It seems roughly in the ball park as to what good pre-facelift 2.8's are fetching these days (before haggling! lol!)..

to give you an idea - I've just bought a 1998 Z3 (2.8), FSH some nice extra's etc with 76k on the clock. It was up for £5k but I agreed a price of £4,700 which included the dealer taxing the car for me. To be honest given my normally sharp negotiating skills I was a little disappointed to only get £300 off and the road tax - but I think dealers know the market better than most and know that summer is just around the corner so might be willing to hold onto these cars a little longer without feeling the pressure of having to sell them.

I've been following the prices for a couple of months now and they definately seem to have levelled off a bit - maybe it's because we are out of winter/bad weather?

For example recently I've seen 2 very good example post facelift 2.8 Z3's go for the same kind of money.. and there also seems to be a few dreamers around on ebay as well asking £5,500-£6,000 for pre facelift 2.8's...

Just my tuppence and observations though! :)

HTH

AW8
Joined: Tue 27 Jan, 2009 12:55
Posts: 439

  Z3 roadster 2.2i
Location: sussex

Post by AW8 » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 10:49

Firstly whilst I already own a BMW and consider myself a clued up buyer and bmw enthusiast I dont yet own a Z3, ( though have driven and viewed a few now), so take or leave my comments as you wish.

Secondly my posts have met a mixed reaction on here as I have made it clear on here from onset I am not preprared to pay over the top for an n early car (preferably a 2.8). Some may see me as a threat to residuals, however, in all sensibility I am but one prosepective buyer & it will take more than me alone to impact on values !

You can search my other posts re my hunting exploits to date. I have currently eased off after recent disappointments & some significantly misdecribed cars as well as having no time very recently due to work and house move.

Re history :

I agree that bmw dealer inspections are not proof of maintenance, however, they do show the oil has been changed and, (depending on inspection type), filters as appropriate. Evidence of coolant change is of reassurance as would be evidence of any other work done. When dealers do inspections they should highlight and recommend any work required. A friend who bought a 1 owner E39 5 series with full & recent main dealer history, however, once in ownership he found the car needing work to sort issues. Only later did he learn that the last inspection had recommended work that the seller was recommended to do yet chose not to (probably as at time he was planning to change).

Main assurance from history is to verify mileage. BMW Inspection sheets supplied at each inspection should have evidence of additional work done or recomedations as advised if owner failed to authorise work being done.

Re History checks : Only available by calling bmw dedicated team on: 0906 209 0001 (Calls are charged at £1 per minute & more from mobiles £1.20 per min from orange for example). They will tell you any dates of dealer visits you then havre to call dealers and do detective work to piece any lost history.


The questions to ask re any used car comanding strong money is :


"Why would anyone chose to dispose of a service book or history ?"

The trade and most buyers/sellers/owners know the impact a lack of history can have on values &/or later buyer desirebaility. I would expect & accept a finance repossesion might be absent of history. (book may have been in owners home when repo'd).

Clocking is more common than many think. Many think typical clocking is for to make a high miler appear as a low miler but most dismiss the concept someone can cause adjustment on a car with 150k miles or more miles down to show say 80-95k miles.

As for the car concerned it's your money if you like it go for it but I would comment as follows :

It is absent of more, (visibly), desireable 16" rims, ( if this bothers you).

Allow for replacing any worn mismatached or budget tyres.

Are you concerned re getting strong money back later ?

Will most later potential buyers love that extended red leather ?

Will lack of history cause others to ask same questions re value that you are now ?

Is it too much money for a car absent of history ?

I see 4k as max for a 97/98 single vanos car with 100k miles and full history wanting for nothing or very little - same car private 3.5k max.
Dogs or thosre absent of history significantly lower............unless of course you get lucky. 4k upwards could bag a nice double vanos car or a facelift. I have seen 3.0i selling asking for circa for 4.5k on forecourts.

It is true that verts' strenghten residually in summer but the higher numbers of tin top vert's mean some in trade have forecast that this year may change this. New Z4 will impact early Z4 money and cheaper Z4's may have knock on with late Z3's & in turn early Z3's. I love the Z3 but remember the values of used competitors are a factor too. £6k can buy a tidy historied early Boxster from an indy trader.

Despite all I have said, (I know I have a lot to say at times :oops: ), I am not for one moment suggesting that cared for cars owned by forum members are of low value and nothing above suggests this. I have seen forum cars that are simply stunning and know of 2 recent sales which were IMO good value. I know first hand that forum membership alone doesnt improve condition or value.


Good Luck
Last edited by AW8 on Sun 01 Mar, 2009 12:19, edited 4 times in total.

pangster
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:09
Posts: 593

  blank

Post by pangster » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 11:04

AW8 wrote: I see 4k as max for a 97/98 single vanos car with 100k miles and full history wanting for nothing or very little - same car private 3.5k max.
Dogs or thosre absent of history significantly lower............unless of course you get lucky.
I agree with most of what you've written (as you know) and the points you raise about FSH and verifiable mileage is something that everyone should consider when buying one of these cars. Old MOT's can also help with verifying mileage as well so like yourself, I would be very worried if looking at a car that had a distinct lack of paperwork - to the extent that alarm bells would be ringing and I would walk away! - not worth the headache.

I think the prices you've mentioned are also in the ball park for what I've seen over the last couple of months as well. There is some leeway for mileage and condition ofcourse, but for the main these seem to be pretty accurate.



:)

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TitanTim
Joined: Mon 23 Jun, 2008 19:56
Posts: 5488

  Z3 roadster 1.9i
Location: Stafford

Post by TitanTim » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 11:52

Welcome to the forum :)

It's a dufficult one regarding proof the car has been seviced at the correct intervals especially if it looks and sounds in good nick, but if the car has been well looked after then it should have a fully stamped up book, usually dealer for the first 3 years then idependents thereafter. Me being me lol I would be slightly concerned if there is a chunk of history missing and no MOT's, it might just indicate the car has been clocked, remember BMW's are well built and hide their mileage better than most. You could check the usual high mileage signs, excessively worn seats, pedal rubbers, windscreen and paint chipping etc but no guarantee. Apparently 1 in 3 cars are clocked :shock:

The Zed in the pics looks in good nick, just my opinion I couldn't live with the in your face red interior and as most post facelift Zed prices are reasonable now I would definitely go for a facelift model as its has slighly better refinements and the backside in Sport guise with lower suspension is much more appealing than the prefacelift, ie more shapely.

Good luck with the search,

Tim.
Image
2001 Z3 1.9 Roadster Sport - 2012 Z4 sDrive 2.0 M Sport

AntMan
Joined: Sun 16 Dec, 2007 17:28
Posts: 448

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Derby

Post by AntMan » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 11:59

I'd add though when you start looking at any car approaching/ at 10 years of age the look/feel of the way the vehicle looks /drives can go a long way.
I know i'm in the minority but i brought my Zed in Dec 2007 very little history with it at all the odd old mot but no much else,the car drove superb looked well for it's age mileage 89k and at the time was a great price.
I've had flawless motoring from this now edging 12 year old zed, service history is not necessary the be all and end all but it does put a few off, only you have driven it seen it a car can look good on paper but be an absolute dog in the flesh, each too their own just my view :) :)
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Zed Carer
Joined: Thu 13 Dec, 2007 20:27
Posts: 1640

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield

Post by Zed Carer » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 13:46

Hi r3v3r3nd and welcome.

I haven't got anything to add re: service histories - always highly desirable to have the history but there can be reasons why its not all there.

The only comment I was going to make was about the extended leather - this was an option when new and I have the blue extended leather. Just looking at the photos I think that you need to check if the leather is starting to debond - the nearside front looks to have a few creases. I thought that it would be a fairly easy fix on mine and it is if you can source the parts! There is an Ebay store in the States that regularly advertises black and red items but so far I haven't managed to find blue! IIRC price was around $150 plus shipping for all three sections.

Good luck with the search!
Hers: Z4 2.0i Sp --------------------- His: Z3 2.8
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r3v3r3nd
Joined: Sat 28 Feb, 2009 16:07
Posts: 16

  Z3 roadster 2.8

Post by r3v3r3nd » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 22:19

Thanks for the comments guys, you've been really insightful.

Things sound good on the reliability front, and thanks for that number AW8!
Even if it is £1/min :shock: I think, if the miles and dates from the servicing dealership(s) tally up, I wouldn't be too bothered about the missing service history.

After reading some of the other threads on here, I've realised that the Z3 I drove suffered from quite abit of tramlining, pulling steadily to the left on straights and needing more input to start turns. Therefore it could be something simple to fix like pressures or laser alignment or something expensive like tyre replacement or the poly bushes!

I think I'm going to try and drive another example for comparison, and then maybe speak to the first dealer about correcting the steering issue.

I'll keep you updated,

R3v

Stoned@Home
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 19:35
Posts: 283

  Z3 roadster 2.0
Location: Sea of Green

Post by Stoned@Home » Sun 01 Mar, 2009 22:37

There should be a warrenty on it at least 3 months i'd say.

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 00:39

Come and test drive my 98 2.8 on a private reg and if you like it you can drive it away with you for £4000 same colour inside and out as the one you posted but mine has all the extras BMW and aftermarket plus its 56K with FSH, I’ve only done 400 mile in the last two years .
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Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

clan
Joined: Wed 14 Jan, 2009 20:21
Posts: 44

  Z3 roadster 2.8

Post by clan » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 14:51

Fixer wrote:Come and test drive my 98 2.8 on a private reg and if you like it you can drive it away with you for £4000 same colour inside and out as the one you posted but mine has all the extras BMW and aftermarket plus its 56K with FSH, I’ve only done 400 mile in the last two years .
PM sent Fixer

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 15:33

Hi clan
Reply sent
Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

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Jonttt
Z Register member
Joined: Sun 28 Dec, 2008 16:32
Posts: 6536

  M roadster S54
Location: Liverpool

Post by Jonttt » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 16:34

Fixer

Now that looks like a good buy :wink: especially with those mods

Puts things into persepctive :D
Happiness is not around the corner........happiness is the corner
Image Video or Journal Garage: 2015 FFRR Black Edition, Porsche Boxster GTS, 1997 Porsche Carrara C4S, Ex 2001 BMW S54 Z3m Roadster

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 17:16

jonttt

Yes M8 your right, it should be far more than £4000 but the fact is I’ve never used it and in today’s climate I think it’s a fair price
Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

xavier999
Joined: Sun 22 Feb, 2009 21:45
Posts: 64

  Z3 roadster 2.8

Post by xavier999 » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 17:47

I would say in the right ball park.
Like Pangster I too have just bought a 1997 2.8 last weekend. Mine is an auto (not many around at that price) and is in really lovely condition, not a mark on it. Done 56k miles with full BMWSH and nice 5 spoke alloys. Was up for £5k but also paid £4750. Couple of niggles (multiplayer CD doesn’t work) but I thought it was a fair price. I agree not many people are looking to take much of a reduction because they believe in 3 months they will get more money, which is possibly true. Having looked for the last month, there are far more manuals than autos out there and I suspect you may find one slightly cheaper. If you find the right car, a couple of hundred quid shouldn’t stand in your way. I am over the moon with mine!

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 18:02

I think the manuals will always sell better than the autos but that’s just my opinion, this car is pristine and every thing works including the multiplayer :) but the alarm has acquired a fault after the battery lost its charged while being stood for months on end without use. I was going to sell her last year but I didn’t so I made my mind up to let it go this spring, if I waited a few months and the price doesn’t go up then I would have to wait while next spring and what would it be worth then
Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

User avatar
Jonttt
Z Register member
Joined: Sun 28 Dec, 2008 16:32
Posts: 6536

  M roadster S54
Location: Liverpool

Post by Jonttt » Mon 02 Mar, 2009 18:05

I agree. Its important to get a "feel" for prices, especially in this climate but that should help you find the right car for you at the right price.

You will always find cars more/less expensive than you have paid but each car is slightly different and one car with be worth more than another to any given person depending on what is important to them.

Important thing is to be happy with what you buy. I bought mine in January and am chuffed to bits with it. Its not perfect but ticked all my boxes and I got it for a fair price. I am loving making it my own :D

I am a great believer in knowing its "the" car for you. Sometimes you have to see a few, sometimes its the first. I always try and have some knowledge first (this site is great for that very thing) but to me if you have any doubts the car is not for you, be patient.
Happiness is not around the corner........happiness is the corner
Image Video or Journal Garage: 2015 FFRR Black Edition, Porsche Boxster GTS, 1997 Porsche Carrara C4S, Ex 2001 BMW S54 Z3m Roadster

pangster
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:09
Posts: 593

  blank

Post by pangster » Tue 03 Mar, 2009 18:05

I think I found the original card on Autotrader:

http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/ww ... egLetter=S

Price is now £4,495.. and it states it has a Full BMSH??.. it also says it has a comprehensive warranty.. which probably isn't worth the paper its written on! LOL!!!...

r3v3r3nd
Joined: Sat 28 Feb, 2009 16:07
Posts: 16

  Z3 roadster 2.8

Post by r3v3r3nd » Wed 04 Mar, 2009 11:57

That's the badger! I didn't link to it initially in case I was gazumped!

Just been for another test drive this morning, a 70kmile 2000 2.8 model, it was much nicer! about £1500 more too, so will need some serious consideration. It also had a tendency to veer slightly from the straight line, so I think its just something to be expected and to make sure you keep your alignment and tire pressures right! On the plus side, this one actually had a filled in log book and a wedge of receipts for work done, so thats a little more reassuring on the care taken!

I haven't shelled out for the BMW premium rate number to check the history on the first one yet, might well not bother :-)

pangster
Joined: Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:09
Posts: 593

  blank

Post by pangster » Wed 04 Mar, 2009 13:47

r3v3r3nd wrote:That's the badger! I didn't link to it initially in case I was gazumped!

Just been for another test drive this morning, a 70kmile 2000 2.8 model, it was much nicer! about £1500 more too, so will need some serious consideration. It also had a tendency to veer slightly from the straight line, so I think its just something to be expected and to make sure you keep your alignment and tire pressures right! On the plus side, this one actually had a filled in log book and a wedge of receipts for work done, so thats a little more reassuring on the care taken!

I haven't shelled out for the BMW premium rate number to check the history on the first one yet, might well not bother :-)
LOL!!! - sorry mate.. I didn't think! :oops: :?

you will get the right one though.. there's plenty out there! :)

Zim
Joined: Thu 25 Sep, 2008 15:42
Posts: 65

  M roadster S52

Post by Zim » Wed 04 Mar, 2009 15:16

Nice looking car fixer, just looking at the pics what's the tiny antennae on the rear bumper?

/Z

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Wed 04 Mar, 2009 15:45

Zim
Some time ago I installed a car PC where the CD changer fit in the boot and the rubber aerial was for the TV.
Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

Fixer
Joined: Sat 18 Sep, 2004 02:08
Posts: 707

  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Wakefield
Contact:

Post by Fixer » Wed 04 Mar, 2009 15:48

Zim wrote:Nice looking car fixer, just looking at the pics what's the tiny antennae on the rear bumper?

/Z
Yep priced to sell , I must have fit £3000 worth of extras
Mods
AC Body Kit
M50 Manifold & BBTB Kit
Stainless Exhaust M style
Remap (Chipped uk )
Gruppe m rep induction kit
Angel Eyes (Chromeline Design)
Strong Strut Front & Rear
White lenses, side repeaters etc

Zim
Joined: Thu 25 Sep, 2008 15:42
Posts: 65

  M roadster S52

Post by Zim » Thu 05 Mar, 2009 08:46

ooo Car PC, i remember doing one when i was at uni.. was great lil project..

Good luck with the sale, car is a looker, the perfect colour combo, (well for me anyway) Sliver - red interior or black with red interior.. :D

/Z

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