Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

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Gareth 161
Joined: Thu 08 Mar, 2012 23:41
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 00:32

Back to the common problem!
Has anyone found a tyre which helps to reduce this tramlining problem as mine getting worse now that front tyres getting low and would appreciate any feedback before I buy some new ones.
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

NZ00Z3
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by NZ00Z3 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 06:22

Hi

Here's my standard reply to tram-lining or poor road handling questions. Have sorted 2 Z3's now with these simple solutions.

Front Axle:
- Replace front control arm rear bushings. Don't use OEM bushings. Use Z3M bushings, poly urethane or http://www.ebay.com/sch/sis.html?_nkw=S ... 2749.l2658
- How old are your tires? Had 10 year old tires on the front that caused handling problems. Put them on the rear and new ones on the front and problem solved.
- If you are getting a tap, tap, tap on the steering wheel and high way speeds, check tie rods and control arm ball joints. I changed the lot on a Z3 with 100,000 miles and solved the problem. Couldn't identify any particular wear area with the normal tests. Concluded that the tap, tap, tap was the cumulative wear of all the parts.

Rear Axle:
- 17 year old rubber bushings are getting soft, even with low milage. Change sub-frame bushings as you may be getting a bit or rear end steering. If the car is your daily drive and comfort is the priority, then use OEM rubber. If you don't mind a bit of an increase in NVH and you are after a stiffer suspension, use Poly Uethane
- Check your rear shocks. The OE shocks don't last. Disconnect the bottom bolt and push/pull to see what sort of action you have left. There should be resistance in both directions from the oil valving. There should also be a gas charge that will force the shock to extend. If you can hold the shock compressed with just a little hand force, then it's stuffed.

As for tires, I only purchase Michelin P3's. Best ride comfort and handling for the 16" stock wheels.

Hope this helps

Regards

Muzz

Del
Joined: Sat 19 Nov, 2011 18:35
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Del » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 11:24

Lots of people have their own preferences. But the ones I have counted as appearing most on this forum for curing tramlining are Avon ZV5

Gareth 161
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Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 18:29

Thanks for the info.
Car has 17 inch staggered wheels so unfortunately can't swap them around.
Only had her 2 months and have had the rear subframe bushes done and new rear shocks but still the same.
Currently have avon z5s on rear with 3-4 mm tread and 1 Avon on the front with about 2 mm.
For some reason the other front is a Yokohama but again only about 2mm.
If they were not staggered would have swapped around and just bought 2 new rears but I either now just get 2 fronts and possibly do the rears as well to get 4 of the same,hence my question as to what to buy.
Will work through some of the good suggestions above over time but had better get the tyres sooner rather than later.
It might be just the fact that the tread is quite low which is causing the problem?
Gareth
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

Gareth 161
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Posts: 104

  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 18:30

Thanks for the info.
Car has 17 inch staggered wheels so unfortunately can't swap them around.
Only had her 2 months and have had the rear subframe bushes done and new rear shocks but still the same.
Currently have avon z5s on rear with 3-4 mm tread and 1 Avon on the front with about 2 mm.
For some reason the other front is a Yokohama but again only about 2mm.
If they were not staggered would have swapped around and just bought 2 new rears but I either now just get 2 fronts and possibly do the rears as well to get 4 of the same,hence my question as to what to buy.
Will work through some of the good suggestions above over time but had better get the tyres sooner rather than later.
It might be just the fact that the tread is quite low which is causing the problem?
Gareth
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

Bonzo
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Location: Norfolk

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Bonzo » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 20:00

Del wrote:Lots of people have their own preferences. But the ones I have counted as appearing most on this forum for curing tramlining are Avon ZV5
I had 2 Avon ZV5's on the rear and 2 part worn Michelins on the front when I got Z3lda, and suffered from quite bad tramlining. I put 2 Avon ZV5's on the front to match the rears and it was like driving a different car, it completely cured the tramlining.

:cheers

Bonzo.
Z3lda (Zelda), 1998 2.8, Montreal Blue, Beige Oregon leather interior and M steering wheel, Sports Seats, Wood trim, Chrome Line Interior, Centre armrest with Cupholder, Alpina Softline wheels, Chromed Angel Eyes, De- tango'd, Rear stone guards, Sport aerial, ASC front strut brace, Strong Strut Butt Strut and Body Brace, Uprated brake fluid, Yellowstuff pads 78k.

Gareth 161
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 20:44

Thanks for that Bonzo-seems like I might be buying some Avons!!
Not sure regarding getting the tracking/alignment done as no obvious wear on tyres and someone said that with an older car with worn suspension,would not do much of an improvement. Any thoughts please (will only press the button once this time!!)
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

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Robert T
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Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Robert T » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 20:54

It is not so much that a specific brand of tyre tramlines and another doesn't, but rather the tyre start to tramline as they wear. Last time I fitted new Michelin to the front of mine, the tramlining went away. Now, after 25k miles, it is back to tramlining again. I like Michelins as they are good in the wet, so next change I might refresh the bushes and droplinks and have the tracking done, to see if I can get them to wear more evenly.

Cheers R.

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Gareth 161
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Mon 15 Aug, 2016 21:34

Thanks so possibly any new tyres will improve things as mine are almost down to the wear indicators.
Does it make much difference if the brands on the front are different to those on the back.?
I can see that they should be the same on the same axle but not sure re front and back.
Obviously when I change the current set up of Avon mixed with yoko, it should also help.
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

Bonzo
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  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Norfolk

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Bonzo » Tue 16 Aug, 2016 00:25

Well, I changed from a Michelin front/Avon rear to Avons all round (ZV5's) and as said, no more tramlining.
Z3lda (Zelda), 1998 2.8, Montreal Blue, Beige Oregon leather interior and M steering wheel, Sports Seats, Wood trim, Chrome Line Interior, Centre armrest with Cupholder, Alpina Softline wheels, Chromed Angel Eyes, De- tango'd, Rear stone guards, Sport aerial, ASC front strut brace, Strong Strut Butt Strut and Body Brace, Uprated brake fluid, Yellowstuff pads 78k.

siwilson
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Location: Horley

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by siwilson » Tue 16 Aug, 2016 11:56

Mixing tyres on a Z3 is always a risk. Sometimes you get away with it, but mostly not. If the rears are good then I would get the exact same make/model on the front. Also look at front lower control arm bushes (lollipops). You can also play with the tyre pressure a little.
2001 M roadster S54 Laguna Seca Blue

John Wilson
Joined: Fri 12 Jun, 2009 13:11
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  Z3 roadster 2.0
Location: Diss

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by John Wilson » Tue 16 Aug, 2016 12:38

I agree with Bonzo. ZV5's on the front completely cured my bad tramlining. It is like driving a different car. And you have the bonus of having 'Z's enbossed all round the tyre.

Bonzo
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  Z3 roadster 2.8
Location: Norfolk

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Bonzo » Wed 17 Aug, 2016 11:02

Yes, I understand Avon made them specially for the Z3! :wink:
Z3lda (Zelda), 1998 2.8, Montreal Blue, Beige Oregon leather interior and M steering wheel, Sports Seats, Wood trim, Chrome Line Interior, Centre armrest with Cupholder, Alpina Softline wheels, Chromed Angel Eyes, De- tango'd, Rear stone guards, Sport aerial, ASC front strut brace, Strong Strut Butt Strut and Body Brace, Uprated brake fluid, Yellowstuff pads 78k.

alec.m
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Location: Lymington

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by alec.m » Wed 17 Aug, 2016 19:17

With 17" staggered set up your choice of brands is limited if you want the same all round. My choice on my 2.8 which had standard 16" wheels was Falken ZE914 , never had any tramlining with them but when I did a search for my 3.0 17" staggered they don`t do the rears. In fact there were only a few of the main well know brands that did a matching set.

Gareth 161
Joined: Thu 08 Mar, 2012 23:41
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Wed 17 Aug, 2016 19:22

Yes I have noticed that there does not appear to be many brands which do both sizes for the 17 inch wheels.
Will have a good online search later.
Would having the tracking or 4 wheel alignment? make much difference to my problem or would the alignment be a waste of money on an old car with old suspensions?
Gareth
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

alec.m
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Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by alec.m » Wed 17 Aug, 2016 19:35

I don`t think there`s much point in paying for 4 wheel alignment as there`s no adjustment on the rear. Front needs tracking, especially with new tyres fitted. As mentione before make sure all the ball joints etc at the front are in good shape first.

Migou
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  Z3 roadster 2.5i

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Migou » Thu 25 Aug, 2016 04:10

I'm about to rebuild my front end on my Z3. I was told that the 95 M3 strut hats will stop trammeling. I have them, I also have the offset bushings to recenter the wheel in the wheel well. I'm waiting for the control arms to be delivered. The M3 hats will add caster. That is what I was told was the culprit. I'm crossing my fingers it stops the trammeling. I love my car, hate the trammeling.

Gareth 161
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Fri 09 Sep, 2016 21:13

Just passed mot but all 4 tyres are needing replacing so opens up the market for any brands now.
Has anyone tried the Goodyear eagle f1 asymmetric as appear to get good reviews.
They seem to come in various speed and load ratings which I find very confusing as only shows ZR in handbook.
Presumably I don't need the XL rated tyres but the rim protection would be useful.
Have seen some at 91Y which I think should be ok but so much choice is confusing!
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

DanHolman
Joined: Sun 10 Jul, 2016 11:43
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by DanHolman » Fri 09 Sep, 2016 21:34

Fit 4 new UniRoyal Rainsport 3 tyres. Use Event tyres.

Gareth 161
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i
Location: Cornwall

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Fri 09 Sep, 2016 21:38

Yes I did read up on them and they seem to get good reviews as well.
Also my local tyre supplier was offering 4 of these for £100 less than the eagle f1s.
I hate so much choice!!
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

Bonzo
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Location: Norfolk

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Bonzo » Sat 10 Sep, 2016 00:43

The Avons (ZV5) have rim protection.

Bonzo.
Z3lda (Zelda), 1998 2.8, Montreal Blue, Beige Oregon leather interior and M steering wheel, Sports Seats, Wood trim, Chrome Line Interior, Centre armrest with Cupholder, Alpina Softline wheels, Chromed Angel Eyes, De- tango'd, Rear stone guards, Sport aerial, ASC front strut brace, Strong Strut Butt Strut and Body Brace, Uprated brake fluid, Yellowstuff pads 78k.

Howard Adams
Joined: Mon 10 Oct, 2016 16:39
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Howard Adams » Fri 20 Jan, 2017 07:40

Hi Guys, the dreaded tram lining has now gone and the car has been transformed. Initially changed front suspension bushes to Polly bushes, a improvement (10/15%) tried altering tyre pressures, no effect. Replaced the 18inch wheels that had 225/40/18 Bridgestone tyres on with 16 inch alloys with 225/50/16 Firestones, so now the car is back to the standard size which it was originally fitted with and more importantly the standard suspension was designed for. What also has a huge effect is the hight of the tyre, 40 to a 50 profile, the harder and lower the tyres are the more likely hood to upset the suspension and handeling.
The car now feels and is safer,more drivable. Safety/drivability over looks for me every time.
I know there are many Z3s that have some stunning wheels fitted and look amazing but sometimes you have to compromise which I have.
Howard

gookah
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Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by gookah » Fri 20 Jan, 2017 17:24

Howard Adams wrote:Hi Guys, the dreaded tram lining has now gone and the car has been transformed. Initially changed front suspension bushes to Polly bushes, a improvement (10/15%) tried altering tyre pressures, no effect. Replaced the 18inch wheels that had 225/40/18 Bridgestone tyres on with 16 inch alloys with 225/50/16 Firestones, so now the car is back to the standard size which it was originally fitted with and more importantly the standard suspension was designed for. What also has a huge effect is the hight of the tyre, 40 to a 50 profile, the harder and lower the tyres are the more likely hood to upset the suspension and handeling.
The car now feels and is safer,more drivable. Safety/drivability over looks for me every time.
I know there are many Z3s that have some stunning wheels fitted and look amazing but sometimes you have to compromise which I have.
Howard
I wonder how much is down to the actual old tyres no longer being used.
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Howard Adams
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Howard Adams » Fri 20 Jan, 2017 20:27

Hi, I suspect it's a combination of both new tyres & Wheels. The wheels & tyres I borrowed (16 inch) had half worn Bridgestones on them and they also rectified the tram lining. Either way each new wheel & tyre weigh 5kg less each then the wheels I took off. Always nice to drive a car with new wheels & tyres.
H

Gareth 161
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Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Gareth 161 » Fri 20 Jan, 2017 20:43

Just an update on my tramlining problem.
Bought 4 Goodyear Eagle F1's and problem cured. Not sure if due to make of tyre or just the fact that they are new tyres but either way very pleased and they are performing well. Will have to see what mileage I get out of them.
Of course whilst there I had the tracking checked and it is out apparently by several degrees. Only problem is that outer track rod ends are seized solid onto the rods so will have to fit new inner and outer track rod ends.
Just picked up some febi ones so this should be my next job.
Gareth
2001 3.0 Z3, 2008 Subaru Forester Xten

Lancsbob
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Location: Ormskirk

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by Lancsbob » Tue 24 Jan, 2017 17:40

Had a lot of trouble sourcing ZV5's been told Avon have stopped making them
& replaced them with ZV7's so if your after any get them fast...

Yes they stopped my tramlining, will be intesting to see if it returns when the get a bit worn.

Bob

therealdb1
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  Z3 roadster 2.0

Re: Best tyres to eliminate tramlining

Post by therealdb1 » Sun 29 Jan, 2017 01:06

I'm a great fan of the ZV5 but Bob is correct Avon have "upgraded" them. :bawl:
Time will tell if the ZV7 are as good!
It's always a pain when you find a product that you like and the manufacturer decides to change it. The NCT was good in its day but the NCT 2's that I had were awful and I have not used Goodyear tyres since. What are we on now, NCT 5 ?

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