Broken suspension springs ??
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- Joined: Tue 14 Nov, 2017 15:01
- Posts: 15
Broken suspension springs ??
I am currently doing research into the purchase of a Z3 or possibly if shoved a Z4 and am tracing back DVLA logged MOT history on any cars that I see which appear to tick most of my must have boxes.
One of the ever recurring failure notices recorded are broken road springs, both front and back................... why is this happening?
Having also spoken to several garage owners it would appear that most makes of cars now suffer from this perplexing problem!
If it is a known Z3/ Z4 problem are there any aftermarket springs that last longer than OE specification products?
Many thanks
One of the ever recurring failure notices recorded are broken road springs, both front and back................... why is this happening?
Having also spoken to several garage owners it would appear that most makes of cars now suffer from this perplexing problem!
If it is a known Z3/ Z4 problem are there any aftermarket springs that last longer than OE specification products?
Many thanks
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Our road conditions are the main cause, deep potholes and the dreaded speed humps all over the place.
Z Springs should be up to the job as with other makes of cars oem quality springs should be ok, you might consider some uprated springs, they are out there. Age of our cars also has some bearing on the failure rate, a mechanical spring will degrade over time.
If you want to stay standard have a look here for Sachs branded springs, considerable savings with Carparts4less
https://www.carparts4less.co.uk/car-springs
Z Springs should be up to the job as with other makes of cars oem quality springs should be ok, you might consider some uprated springs, they are out there. Age of our cars also has some bearing on the failure rate, a mechanical spring will degrade over time.
If you want to stay standard have a look here for Sachs branded springs, considerable savings with Carparts4less
https://www.carparts4less.co.uk/car-springs
Colb
1999 BMW 1.8 Z3
2003 BMW 2.5 Z4
1998 Honda Deauville NT650V
1999 BMW 1.8 Z3
2003 BMW 2.5 Z4
1998 Honda Deauville NT650V
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Changing broken springs is one of the commonest jobs done by workshops these days. By the time I traded in my Mondeo it only had one original spring left. The new VW I replaced it with broke a spring after about 4 years. It isn't just a Z3 problem. It's a universal problem.
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- Joined: Fri 29 Jul, 2016 13:16
- Posts: 39
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Bit more to this than simply road conditions.
Springs should be changed in pairs,I have experienced fractured springs at both ends of my Z3 in 9 years, so car has now had 4 springs fitted.
Why anybody would fit single replacement springs is beyond me!
Why would a car be on its last original spring unless corners are being cut?
Failure mode is well known-plastic coating fatigues and cracks,water + road salt enters and resultant corrosion leads to a highly stressed local weakness which then worsens as spring collapses ans fault area widens=more water entry=failure.
All my replacements were fitted with care not to damage or scrape coating and treated to prevent rusting using Dinitrol.
Springs should be changed in pairs,I have experienced fractured springs at both ends of my Z3 in 9 years, so car has now had 4 springs fitted.
Why anybody would fit single replacement springs is beyond me!
Why would a car be on its last original spring unless corners are being cut?
Failure mode is well known-plastic coating fatigues and cracks,water + road salt enters and resultant corrosion leads to a highly stressed local weakness which then worsens as spring collapses ans fault area widens=more water entry=failure.
All my replacements were fitted with care not to damage or scrape coating and treated to prevent rusting using Dinitrol.
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- Joined: Tue 14 Nov, 2017 15:01
- Posts: 15
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Geeeeez the springs are plastic coated, no wonder they break.zedzedthree wrote: ↑Sat 25 Nov, 2017 16:28 Bit more to this than simply road conditions.
Springs should be changed in pairs,I have experienced fractured springs at both ends of my Z3 in 9 years, so car has now had 4 springs fitted.
Why anybody would fit single replacement springs is beyond me!
Why would a car be on its last original spring unless corners are being cut?
Failure mode is well known-plastic coating fatigues and cracks,water + road salt enters and resultant corrosion leads to a highly stressed local weakness which then worsens as spring collapses ans fault area widens=more water entry=failure.
All my replacements were fitted with care not to damage or scrape coating and treated to prevent rusting using Dinitrol.
Is there a manufacturer of springs who doesn't plastic coat them so that from day one you can coat them in Dinitrol, Waxoil or any such similar coating?
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- Joined: Tue 25 Jun, 2013 21:47
- Posts: 263
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
This was a common failure on the Vauxhall Cavalier / Chevette in the mid to late 1970's so it is not a new phenomenon.
It is not a particularly difficult or expensive repair and road springs have to be seen as consumable items like suspension bushes or shock absorbers. It is just that rather than gradually wearing out they suffer catastrophic failure and the first you know about it is a dropped ride height or MOT refusal.
It is not a particularly difficult or expensive repair and road springs have to be seen as consumable items like suspension bushes or shock absorbers. It is just that rather than gradually wearing out they suffer catastrophic failure and the first you know about it is a dropped ride height or MOT refusal.
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- Joined: Wed 11 Apr, 2007 13:13
- Posts: 160
- Location: Billingham
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
The BMW E46 M3 is also renown for breaking rear springs. The 2003 car I purchased back in 2009 had to have a pair of new OEM rear springs fitted just before I bought it as when the seller took for a new MOT it failed, offside rear spring broken. I had the car for 3 years and had to get another set fitted as again the offside rear was found to be broken just before I sold it in 2012.
Pete C
2000 Z3M Coupe - Cosmos Black Metallic/Black Interior.
Previous BMWs
2003 E46 M3 6 speed manual - Carbon Black/Black Interior.
2000 Z3M Coupe - Cosmos Black/Black Interior
1986 M635
1985 E28 M5
1983 E28 528i Alpina
2000 Z3M Coupe - Cosmos Black Metallic/Black Interior.
Previous BMWs
2003 E46 M3 6 speed manual - Carbon Black/Black Interior.
2000 Z3M Coupe - Cosmos Black/Black Interior
1986 M635
1985 E28 M5
1983 E28 528i Alpina
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Not on my VW. All I noticed was a gentle clicking noise when riding over bumps. Rear spring had snapped but you would never know from looking at the car or driving it. The springs on my Mondeo were replaced singly by my local workshop, and so was the VW one by a different workshop. The cars were perfectly all right with one new spring and one original. As for powder coating springs - what a daft idea, but it's commonly done. I don't like powder coating at all. It's fine until a small chip occurs and then the water and rust get underneath and it comes off in large flakes. Chassis paint does a better job on subframes and suspension arms.therealdb1 wrote: ↑Sat 25 Nov, 2017 17:09 It is just that rather than gradually wearing out they suffer catastrophic failure and the first you know about it is a dropped ride height or MOT refusal.
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- Joined: Tue 14 Nov, 2017 15:01
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Re: Broken suspension springs ??
So when it comes to the Z3 what are the best springs to go for, and if they were to come powder coated what is the best way to remove the blessed stuff and then recoat it in Waxoil or similar?
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
That wont prevent it all together,zedzedthree wrote: ↑Sat 25 Nov, 2017 16:28
All my replacements were fitted with care not to damage or scrape coating and treated to prevent rusting using Dinitrol.
Salt/Grit gets on the spring base of the shocker or trailing arm
The movement of the spring then presses it on the grit and it punctures the coating. Once done, its a time bomb rotting from inside out,
Plastic coating is stupid. they always seem to break near the bottom where it has sat on the grit.
Z3 2.8 Progress Journal (Mine)
Z3 1.9 Sport Progress Journal (Wifey's)
I have an element of 'M-styling' on my car, If that's a good enough reason for the manufacturers to adorn a 320 with the M badge, then its certainly a good enough reason for me..
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- Joined: Tue 25 Jun, 2013 21:47
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Re: Broken suspension springs ??
I bet the MOT tester would have spotted it. They always seem to on my cars! Its a bread and butter job for them these days.Rear spring had snapped but you would never know from looking at the car or driving it.
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- Joined: Fri 29 Jul, 2016 13:16
- Posts: 39
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
When my OSR spring (the first failure) was picked up at MOT,the tester was taken aback when I thanked him.There was no obvious settling,car drove alright and being winter,my driving was proportionate and no fast corners etc.
I did not suggest that Dinitrol was a sure fire solution to prevent a recurrence however the coating must be cracking by now,especially on the rears that have been on for years and a visual check shows no flaking so it appears ingress of water has been delayed despite ultimately being inevitable.
My replacements have been OEM Sachs.
Thank goodness we have annual MOT testing-just think how many other poorly maintained cars are driving around with broken springs.
Coil springs have a finite life and are subject to settling and worse,fatigue.This is why they should always be replaced as a pair,not to mention havingtogo through the process again when the old fatigued remaining spring gives in.
I did not suggest that Dinitrol was a sure fire solution to prevent a recurrence however the coating must be cracking by now,especially on the rears that have been on for years and a visual check shows no flaking so it appears ingress of water has been delayed despite ultimately being inevitable.
My replacements have been OEM Sachs.
Thank goodness we have annual MOT testing-just think how many other poorly maintained cars are driving around with broken springs.
Coil springs have a finite life and are subject to settling and worse,fatigue.This is why they should always be replaced as a pair,not to mention havingtogo through the process again when the old fatigued remaining spring gives in.
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
I had my first MOT spring failure this year on my trusty Astra wagon. I bought a new pair, watched a YouTube video, and replaced both sides in under 1 hour myself1 Just jacked up the rear, let handbrake off and then there is enough room to wiggle the spring out, and pop the new one in.
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- Joined: Tue 14 Nov, 2017 15:01
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Re: Broken suspension springs ??
As an ex very long term LR Defender owner, in all of the tens of thousands of miles driven over some atrocious roads and off road conditions, I never had a single coil spring failure and I never heard of any on any of the LR specific forums I frequented.zedzedthree wrote: ↑Mon 27 Nov, 2017 12:31 Coil springs have a finite life and are subject to settling and worse,fatigue.This is why they should always be replaced as a pair,not to mention havingtogo through the process again when the old fatigued remaining spring gives in.
So as this is the case could it be that relatively lightweight coil springs are more prone to failure?
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- Joined: Fri 29 Jul, 2016 13:16
- Posts: 39
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
An interesting observation on LR Defender springs Vs Z3,have known quite a few LR variant ( Range Rover/Discovery) owners who also had no broken springs.
The Z3 was launched and equipped with progressive OEM springs with relatively small diameter coil ends as US pre sales testing found a buyer preference for a little initial softness compared to solid springs.
My experience has been that the initial failure has been at the end turn of the spring (common also on other car makes) and having seen quite a few on other Z3's this seems to be the failure mode but my first broken spring was a rear that failed at around mid way,both fronts were breaking from the ends.
The Z3 was launched and equipped with progressive OEM springs with relatively small diameter coil ends as US pre sales testing found a buyer preference for a little initial softness compared to solid springs.
My experience has been that the initial failure has been at the end turn of the spring (common also on other car makes) and having seen quite a few on other Z3's this seems to be the failure mode but my first broken spring was a rear that failed at around mid way,both fronts were breaking from the ends.
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- Joined: Tue 25 Jun, 2013 21:47
- Posts: 263
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
Are they the ones with air suspension!!!zedzedthree wrote: ↑Fri 01 Dec, 2017 11:40 have known quite a few LR variant ( Range Rover/Discovery) owners who also had no broken springs
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
That did break...
Graham (G4FUJ)
Prescott marshal and Hill Controller
Found another Z3 so back here after a long break 1999 1.9, Palmetto Green
1 Morgan 4/4 (selling in Spring) and a Land Rover 90 (keeping forever)
Prescott marshal and Hill Controller
Found another Z3 so back here after a long break 1999 1.9, Palmetto Green
1 Morgan 4/4 (selling in Spring) and a Land Rover 90 (keeping forever)
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
I live abroad and (up until recently) came over on a regular basis to visit the family in Brecon (Wales). I can only say that British roads are, in general, absolutely appauling. It's not just the pot holes and speed bumps, it's the drainage and manhole covers that remain at a fixed position when the road around them is re-surfaced and raised. This can often cause a 4" dip. Only way i could avoid this was driving against the white line (in a LHD car) down country roads between Newport and Brecon (not that the M20, M26, M25 and M4 are any beter).
It's great to get off the boat in Dunkerque and drive on "flat" tarmac all the way to the Netherlands.
And...... if they need to resurface a motorway over here it's a damn sight quicker, and if you drive past them EVERYBODY is working and doing something to do with road works.
So, it's not a surprise that changing springs is becoming a national passtime.
Dave
If it ain't broke, don't fix it
Z3 1.9 2000, Cosmos Schwartz
Z3 1.9 2000, Cosmos Schwartz
Re: Broken suspension springs ??
I don't know. My 40 year old Triumph still has its original springs with no sign of damage. New Zealand roads are probably rougher than yours too. Sure our springs lose their tension but never seem to break.
Maybe today's springs are harder.
Tony
Maybe today's springs are harder.
Tony
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- Joined: Fri 29 Jul, 2016 13:16
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Re: Broken suspension springs ??
My daughter's Renault passed its MOT with no advisories a month ago,test station used one of the dynamic shake & bump type gadgets-2 weeks later has a broken front spring so a new OEM pair fitted pronto,the so called plastic coating was laughable and almost see through at the end coils.
Whilst we did not see so many broken spring 40 years ago,my Triumph Dolomite Sprint did break a front one at 10 years and 80k miles.
There is so much to this phenomenon including Hydrogen embrittlement,flaky coating,bumps,holes and bucking MOT testers.
Whilst we did not see so many broken spring 40 years ago,my Triumph Dolomite Sprint did break a front one at 10 years and 80k miles.
There is so much to this phenomenon including Hydrogen embrittlement,flaky coating,bumps,holes and bucking MOT testers.